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Post by DrD on Oct 2, 2008 12:29:54 GMT -5
Ok so I'm reading all these "literary classics" for English lit two years in a row now. I can't help but roll my eyes sometimes at how poorly drawn the characters are and how out of place some of threads seem. I've learned to like the classics but I don't love them. The writing doesn't speak to me in the way a good modern work does and I can't help but compare them to works I love like Stanek's. Not only are Stanek's Kingdoms and Dragons books well written but they have all the qualities that make classics classics. One aspect I rarely see anyone talk about is the deep sense of romantisism.
Tolkien said his stories on a deep level were romances. Staneks are obviously so as well. The great love story in the book is the love between Captain Brodst and Delinna. There love spans decades and it takes all eight books to get to the truth of their love. A romantic tragedy to rival the best of the great tragedies that can only be understood in retrospect or by rereading the books.
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Post by Shire Hobbit on Oct 10, 2008 21:16:12 GMT -5
Interesting thoughts DrD, the romance between Captain Brodst and Delinna is central to the story and indeed a strong interest to me as a reader. Not sure why it's not talked about as much as say the dragon king or the wolmerrelle or such. My guess is that it's not something easy to wrap your head around. Like many it took a second reading to see the whole story and I had many ah! moments when I finally understood. The issue at heart is that the main threads are so interesting that it's easy to lose the subtler deeper threads, especially the many deep threads connecting through all eight books. Not the only one either what with King Andrew and Alexandria's love, its backstory affecting Great Kingdom through Andrew's actions. Also the romantic tension between Adrina and Emel which carries throughout the early books and comes to define Emel. He can't act on his feelings and this makes him want to get far away from the source of his pain, leaving an unfulfilled promise for the future.
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Post by GrimReaper on Nov 16, 2008 16:38:54 GMT -5
When I first read the books to be honest, I didn't care or catch on to the love stories but as I reread the books and have gotten older I see this more clearly. As with Tolkien, Stanek's romances are below the surface, rather subtle, there if you want to be carried away in them. Tolkien's Rings has one great romance at the center of it: the love between Aragorn son of Arathorn and Arwen Evenstar. This is a tragic love story of two who love each other but cannot be together due to circumstances beyond their control. There love story is told over the course of the three books.
Stanek's Kingdoms and Dragons tells the stories of the Alders. The love between King Andrew and his queen is one of several great romances, told mostly through Andrew's actions and reminisceses. Each of his children has a romance (except for Adrina who is the youngest). Valam with the elven queen. Calyin with her northern lord. Delinna with her captain. Adrina as the youngest has flirtations like with Emel but no true romance yet. Out of all these, the great romance is that of Delinna. Delinna's backstory is told across all eight books and the love story can only be understood after a careful reading of all eight books. It is tragic and perhaps one of the great love stories of all time. So like Tolkien's Rings are Stanek's books misunderstood by the masses? Seems so.
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Post by Shire Hobbit on Nov 21, 2008 20:37:35 GMT -5
Interesting thoughts Grim. The books truly are about the great houses of the Kingdoms of Men. The Alders, the Tyr'anths, and the rest. Can't wait to learn more about the rest of the great houses. One thing I recently realized is the connections between the members of the "great families" of the kingdoms. There's a good history of the Froen d'Gas and the rest in the ruin mist encyclopedia.
The story between Ansh and Delinna is a good one, very deep. By the end, you finally understand them completely. The many nuansces to their story are fascinating. Its things like that that make the books so good.
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Post by Sparhawk on Nov 22, 2008 2:07:54 GMT -5
I think that the most interesting stories are the ones in which the characters has to defeat the evil in his story both as a threat to his life and the life to his close people, but also as a dark side in himself.
Stanek showed this in a brilliant way with Vilmos.
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Post by huntress on Dec 7, 2008 23:35:31 GMT -5
The story of Delinna and Ansh is tragic, sad and vivid. I loved how it threads across the entire series and is finally resolved in the last pages. It left me wanting to know their whole story.
Vilmos's story is interesting and deep as well. In that his story is resolved over the whole of the series. He battles not only evil of the world but the evil within himself. I think it speaks to the inner struggles we all face in our everyday lives.
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Post by GrimReaper on Dec 15, 2008 21:46:51 GMT -5
Interesting thoughts Grim. The books truly are about the great houses of the Kingdoms of Men. The Alders, the Tyr'anths, and the rest. Can't wait to learn more about the rest of the great houses. One thing I recently realized is the connections between the members of the "great families" of the kingdoms. There's a good history of the Froen d'Gas and the rest in the ruin mist encyclopedia. The story between Ansh and Delinna is a good one, very deep. By the end, you finally understand them completely. The many nuansces to their story are fascinating. Its things like that that make the books so good. Like I said, I didn't catch it the first time as I was much younger but now as I read the books I see it and it makes the books all the better. The Alder family is very interesting and I know RS has to get deeper into the other side next with the Tyr'anths. I liked also the other families from the Brodsts onward. I hope Delinna has a bigger part in the books too alongside Adrina. |
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Post by GrimReaper on Dec 15, 2008 21:50:23 GMT -5
I think that the most interesting stories are the ones in which the characters has to defeat the evil in his story both as a threat to his life and the life to his close people, but also as a dark side in himself. Stanek showed this in a brilliant way with Vilmos. Definitely, truly, awesome insight --- it surely is a subtheme. Vilmos battled within himself and with the world. He became both villain and hero. Delinna has the role of both hero and villain too, and then there's Edward who seeks redemption from some (what must be assumed as) dark acts through Vilmos. |
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Post by GrimReaper on Dec 15, 2008 21:52:29 GMT -5
The story of Delinna and Ansh is tragic, sad and vivid. I loved how it threads across the entire series and is finally resolved in the last pages. It left me wanting to know their whole story. Vilmos's story is interesting and deep as well. In that his story is resolved over the whole of the series. He battles not only evil of the world but the evil within himself. I think it speaks to the inner struggles we all face in our everyday lives. A tragic love story but with a uplifting ending, no? Very realistic with how such a relationship would/could evolve between royalty and commoner. I like that about speaking tothe inner struggles we all face. |
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Post by AdrinaAlder on Dec 25, 2008 0:05:35 GMT -5
The love story of Delinna and Ansh is beautifully written and truly epic in scope. I agree it takes several reads to understand it clearly or at the very least hints / pointers from friends who have already read the books. But I think it is better to discover these kinds of things about the books on your own. It's like with all of RS's foreshadowing of events and stuff. Like when he foreshadows something in one book that is fully revealed multiple books later. There's so many like that it's what makes the books so incredible.
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Post by Shire Hobbit on Jan 1, 2009 0:03:16 GMT -5
This is turning into a great discussion on areas I have seen talked about elsewhere on RSMB. RS surely put romance into the stories but its not the type that beats you over the head more subtle. I would agree like the great epic love stories of Lord of the Rings and such where it is just one more thing that makes the story so great. I'd like to know the larger story of all the Alders.
I know some might not agree but the Tyr'anths too. Jarom as the spurned lover, puts in interesting twist. We've heard he's so terrible but we've only seen him through others eyes. Well okay mostly through others eyes, he does come to the kingdoms but perhaps his actions are not seen in the right context.
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Post by Sparhawk on Jan 8, 2009 14:13:02 GMT -5
Yes, probably Jarom was very wounded when he lost the queen.
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